34 replies to this topic

[Sloan]

Kevin, I don't know whether the NJ RR museum is DOA, but it certainly has had a major setback when the state legislature pulled the plug on funding. In addition, IIRC, Phillipsburg itself expropriated a large chunk of land that the museum was counting on for shops and yards. Needless to say the museum leadership was not happy and expressed its feelings in some postings on RyPN.org. Sorry, I can't cite a link. As far cross-border transit is concerned, yes, LANTA and NJT can effect such service. This cooperation is what will happen with the proposed Hoboken—Scranton service utilizing NJT train sets.....if only Pennsylvania would quit foot-dragging. For trains to enter the Lehigh Valley, NJT would have to negotiate with private bus operators—Carl Bieber Tourways and Trans Bridge. Federal Transit Administration regulations require that before new service starts, the proposing agency must show that private operators do not provide the service already or will not suffer a negative impact from a competing public body. Sloan

[KevinKorell]

Federal Transit Administration regulations require that before new service starts, the proposing agency must show that private operators do not provide the service already or will not suffer a negative impact from a competing public body.

Well when Midtown Direct was implemented it hurt service for two private bus carriers with New Jersey-New York service, namely DeCamp Bus Lines and Coach USA/Lakeland Bus Lines. DeCamp suffered further when the Montclair Branch became the Montclair-Boonton Line when the connector was opened in Montclair (literally in the backyard of DeCamp's headquarters). Both have complained.... although after the fact. So were there negotiations beforehand?

[Sloan]

Don't know about NJT's situation. Like everything else in government, there are fine points which lawyers on both sides exploit as they advocate for their clients. I based my assertion on what I learned as a board member of Capital Area Transit (CAT). Before launching faux trolley service, the agency had to check with private bus operators to see if they would object. They did not. Also, before taking over interurban service to Hershey, CAT asked Capitol Trailways if the inter-city bus operator, which was receiving a state subsidy on the route, would step aside. Trailways did. Sloan

[KevinKorell]

For trains to enter the Lehigh Valley, NJT would have to negotiate with private bus operators—Carl Bieber Tourways and Trans Bridge. Federal Transit Administration regulations require that before new service starts, the proposing agency must show that private operators do not provide the service already or will not suffer a negative impact from a competing public body.

NJT has a good relationship with Trans Bridge. NJT used to operate the bus line between New York City and Allentown, PA, making a few limited stops in New Jersey. They were in competition with Trans Bridge, but eventually gave everything over to them. NJT still handles their ticketing in Port Authority Bus Terminal and Newark Airport, and prints their timetables. So I would expect the two to get along amicably should NJT wish to return to the Lehigh Valley, albeit by rail instead of bus.

Bieber Tourways runs less frequent service, and between the Lehigh Valley and both New York and Philadelphia. I don't know how receptive they would be to competing rail service, or whether they would step aside and let trains take over. Of course in the case of Philly, SEPTA's diesel-phobia and the severance of tracks/ROW may continue be a roadblock.

[Sloan]

Time for a rant regarding the disuse of the Bethlehem line. It's appalling that policymakers allowed the Bethlehem line to go fallow. Even with trees growing on the right-of-way, this double track line—rails still in place—would would be an economical antidote to the congestion on parallel Route 309. I think that's the right route number. In fairness, cheap gasoline and Septa's lack of marketing made rail service a low priority in regional planning. Ten years ago, before NS cut the line I asked a Lehigh County economic development executive about pushing for train service restoration. His reply was something to the effect of: "Oh, I wanted rail, but nobody wants to get out of his or her car. Besides, our real estate folks are pushing to sell plots (for commercial develoment) along the highway." If Septa will get the Qaukertown service started with dual mode equipment or dmus, at least all won't be lost. End of rant. Sloan

[jis]

Federal Transit Administration regulations require that before new service starts, the proposing agency must show that private operators do not provide the service already or will not suffer a negative impact from a competing public body.

Well when Midtown Direct was implemented it hurt service for two private bus carriers with New Jersey-New York service, namely DeCamp Bus Lines and Coach USA/Lakeland Bus Lines. DeCamp suffered further when the Montclair Branch became the Montclair-Boonton Line when the connector was opened in Montclair (literally in the backyard of DeCamp's headquarters). Both have complained.... although after the fact. So were there negotiations beforehand?

As far as Montclair is concerned DeCamp, which receives most of the buses that it runs from NJDOT or PANYNJ huffed and puffed, and sued NJT and lost. Instead they could have been more constructive and figured out ample opportunities to provide feeder service to the Montclair and the Midtown Direct lines, but they didn't.

I am not as familiar with what Lakeland did, but complain they sure did, and loudly at that. But then Lakeland gets most of its buses from NJDOT or PANYNJ too AFAIK. So I don't know how private all this so called private service is. Anyway, I am not aware of FTA having anything to say this way or that on those two cases. They were perfectly aware of the issues throughout the EIS process for both and had no problem approving the EISs.

[Sloan]

Since NJ RR Museum rolling stock won't have a home in Phillipsburg, it will have to take its chances with the "elements."

Sloan

http://rypn.sunserve...9c308df50a55d82

[Sloan]

http://www.nj.com/ex...d....xml&coll=2

[KevinKorell]

Of course the railfan in me starts drooling at the thought of both the Montclair-Boonton and the Raritan Valley Lines being extended to Phillipsburg. Can you say, Philly-Burg Fest?

[KevinKorell]

From Allentown, PA Morning Call, 8/9/08:

For decades, rail enthusiasts pushing for passenger train service into the Lehigh Valley have been brushed aside as history buffs letting their dreams mask the reality that America's golden age of rail travel is passed.

For this story, look over here.